Well the guys thats goin to be tuning my car offered to sell me a set of low mile ported l26 heads. I told him i didnt know if i could get the cash in time, but am still interested. If i get ported heads, i would want headers right? Because your opening up the exhaust ports even more. So then my setup would be HV3, ported heads, headers, intake, and shift kit. Give me your thoughts about all of the above. No "go supercharged, or turbo" comments because im not spending that much.

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DIY intake-HV3-3" catless dp-180 tsat-DIY shift kit-murphy custom tune

Just not worth it, if not boosted IMHO.
You would probably spend less top swapping than buying ported N/A heads, and get a whole lot more fun out of it.
But you asked my thoughts, and honestly I think it'll be boring and slow.

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'04 GP CompG - 2.6" junk

There is a nice difference in the performance of the car. But only really notcable with plog and ported rear manifold.

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Why have more money than brains? Cuz RACE CAR :

Save the money for something else... dare I say forced induction?
Seriously though, there's no real noticeable gain with ported heads unless you can actually outflow your stock ones, which with no cam, no boost, no HR rockers, etc you are well within the stock heads flow capabilities. Opening up the exhaust though would help out, but heads alone with no valvetrain breathing mods will net you very little gains. The catch 22 on porting N/A heads though is if you port them too much you loose intake flow velocity and thus loose power down low (same concept behind the HV3. You can port more with additional breathing mods though), port too little.... well that's a stock head haha

Having said all that now, I'm going to go back to P&Ping my car's head

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Dubs:00 VW GTI VR6, Low and Slow 91 VW GTI 8v, Shave the Bay!! 91 VW Cabriolet 8v, bitch Basket
GP's:04 GP GT, Past now G-Ma's Girlfriend's 97 GP GT, "Project Pink Power"

I polished my intake ports, slightly ported and polished the exhaust, polished the lower intake, and never touched anything else and I did see a difference. Better power throughout the whole range, slightly increased fuel economy, and a slight change in the exhaust note. I run stock valvetrain, Plog and ported rear Mani with an aftermarket exhaust. Just shine up the intake passages without taking out too much meat. It is costly to have someone else dothe work, so what I would suggest is find an old set of heads at a wreckers and practice up on them yourself. It is very time consuming but well worth the experience in the end.

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Fast.Loud.Shiny

Hello, I usually spend my time on ClugGP. However I thought I would straighten-out a few misconceptions here. A) Simply port-matching will out flow stock heads and simply replacing the valves with Si valves (REV) from ZZP, will also out flow stock heads due to thier under-cut stems. B) Ported heads installed on a otherwise stock engine will always add noticable power. C) The same flow rates for a blown engine work on small cam N/A applications. Milling the heads 0.035 will give you 10:1 compression and add torque accross the entire rpm band (0-infinity), while adding upper band HP (4K+). It's his car and if the heads are a reasonable deal to him then let him since heads are the biggest performance bang for the buck next to a CAM. Top-swapping with his mods+heads, will allow him to pass you. Oh, I currently hold the stock-cam N/A record for two years now and have read about hundreds of people in the US and AUSTRALIA doing top-swaps with the same HP numbers, same ET's and no originality. All-motor is much harder to compete. Check me on the "NEW HP Cam Chart" under "General" in the ClubGP forums.

Misconceptions? Outflow doesn't always mean more "POWER!!!!" to quote Jeremy Clarkson. Flow velocity is also a huge importance on a N/A motor. Can't beat physics/fluid dynamics. If the head can flow more air than the engine can possibly suck in during one stroke, then obviously there isn't going to give a big power increase, and if you're flowing more air which now can't be used, you then lose flow velocity. Yes, upping compression would increase power, but we're not talking about that, and yes slightly P&Ping heads would also increase power, but there's cheaper ways to make more power in the same amount of time This is all also assuming that these heads which are being discussed were ported correctly (he didn't mention who did them so who knows.)

This line doesn't even make sense and what happened to the whole N/A rules all attitude? If he was going to topswap, why would he buy P&P'ed L26 heads? Unless this line is somehow supposed to mean, topswap with L26 heads, and somehow throw his HV3 all in the mix just for fun.
I can't speak for Kaleb, but I know when I was 18 I didn't have a couple grand to blow on a big bad nasty N/A bat out of hell. P&Ped heads can give a gain (perhaps I should have rephrased my first post to be more specific to showing improvement with additional mods), but x gain for x money isn't really worth it, especially if he then has to spend time and money taking his heads off and putting new ones on and if he's going to do all that, why not just get L32 heads/topswap and be done with it?
The ego/advertisement doesn't exactly help your post by the way. There's no need to post your resume..... Wait.... where have I seen this before..... oh wait.... compg2004's thread. My bad

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Dubs:00 VW GTI VR6, Low and Slow 91 VW GTI 8v, Shave the Bay!! 91 VW Cabriolet 8v, bitch Basket
GP's:04 GP GT, Past now G-Ma's Girlfriend's 97 GP GT, "Project Pink Power"

out of boardem and sense i have the program (engine anlyzer

stock L36
200hp 240tq

ported heads, 180 stat, 93 fuel
237hp 263tq

top swap, 180 stat, 93 fuel, 3.8 pulley
258hp 276tq


i am not the smartest but i am a cheap bastared. top swap $450-$600 including the PCM

heads you are looking at $900 and still slower then most GTPs

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92 LeBaron Convert: Turbo 3L 97 Grand Prix GT 4dr "Frankenstein": L67 4t65 swap
97 Grand Marquis: Summer DD 99 Grand Prix GTP: Top Swap Beater

Ohhhhh......????? Do tell!!!! Guessing none of my engines though right?

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Dubs:00 VW GTI VR6, Low and Slow 91 VW GTI 8v, Shave the Bay!! 91 VW Cabriolet 8v, bitch Basket
GP's:04 GP GT, Past now G-Ma's Girlfriend's 97 GP GT, "Project Pink Power"

nope only thing they have for VW is the beetle 4 cyl


i would have to find every thing and put it in manualy

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92 LeBaron Convert: Turbo 3L 97 Grand Prix GT 4dr "Frankenstein": L67 4t65 swap
97 Grand Marquis: Summer DD 99 Grand Prix GTP: Top Swap Beater

Bummer. So what do you do. Just add listed mods and it spits out an estimated number? You should totally make a thread doing that for everyone then see how close it is to dyno numbers + %Power Lost to Wheels and see how close it is.

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Dubs:00 VW GTI VR6, Low and Slow 91 VW GTI 8v, Shave the Bay!! 91 VW Cabriolet 8v, bitch Basket
GP's:04 GP GT, Past now G-Ma's Girlfriend's 97 GP GT, "Project Pink Power"

little more complex. i had to look up the CFM flow numbers of the heads and the CC, valve diameter, intake port length, port diameter, ect...


also no IC for roots blowers or meth so....

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92 LeBaron Convert: Turbo 3L 97 Grand Prix GT 4dr "Frankenstein": L67 4t65 swap
97 Grand Marquis: Summer DD 99 Grand Prix GTP: Top Swap Beater

Settle down now guys. Matt your right i dont have 3g's to throw around with performance parts. Ive been around long enough to know that my n/a isnt going to be fast without a ton of money, but the reality is after college this will just be a regular DD. Tom if you can find me a topswap for 600 bucks i would be really grateful to you, but superchargers alone are 200. Not saying it oculdnt be done for 600, but i cant have parts laying around for awhile while i gather the rest. I will probably just not get the heads because im getting my downpipe installed next friday. Thanks for all the advice though

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DIY intake-HV3-3" catless dp-180 tsat-DIY shift kit-murphy custom tune

No one's getting worked up . Gotta be nice so the new mods don't have to actually do anything around here J/K J/K Just don't want to see someone blow a ton of money on something and then just want to go even bigger and badder later on down the road. I'm a broke college student so my modding philosophy, or lack thereof since I don't really like going faster, is do it right the first time so you save money in the long run. P&Ped N/A heads will just give you another taste of the sweet power candy and then you'll be wanting more and more until........ boost.
I'll keep an eye out as well for a top swap for a reasonable price though.

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Dubs:00 VW GTI VR6, Low and Slow 91 VW GTI 8v, Shave the Bay!! 91 VW Cabriolet 8v, bitch Basket
GP's:04 GP GT, Past now G-Ma's Girlfriend's 97 GP GT, "Project Pink Power"

you seriously need to quit with the "B" word.

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DIY intake-HV3-3" catless dp-180 tsat-DIY shift kit-murphy custom tune

I haven't said bitch once this entire time Pat on the other hand seems to think that I call my girlfriend that all the time.
You didn't say anything against nitrous though

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Dubs:00 VW GTI VR6, Low and Slow 91 VW GTI 8v, Shave the Bay!! 91 VW Cabriolet 8v, bitch Basket
GP's:04 GP GT, Past now G-Ma's Girlfriend's 97 GP GT, "Project Pink Power"

i have a top swap $400. the S/C only has 30,000

but that is a 97-03 top swap and it will work just as well as a 04+ top swap just need to find a fuel rail and they make TB adapters

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92 LeBaron Convert: Turbo 3L 97 Grand Prix GT 4dr "Frankenstein": L67 4t65 swap
97 Grand Marquis: Summer DD 99 Grand Prix GTP: Top Swap Beater

but it wont be as efficient as a Gen V. Besides im not looking for a really fast car anymore, because as most people know the w-body is dying, and there are bigger and better platforms to go for. So if i would topswap (not likely) i would do a Gen V. Thanks for the offer though

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DIY intake-HV3-3" catless dp-180 tsat-DIY shift kit-murphy custom tune

then why bother with ported heads lol silly

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92 LeBaron Convert: Turbo 3L 97 Grand Prix GT 4dr "Frankenstein": L67 4t65 swap
97 Grand Marquis: Summer DD 99 Grand Prix GTP: Top Swap Beater

cuz they would be cheaper then all that other stuff. But then i realized i would need headers/ported manifolds so thats another 150-200. So i just told him ill pass on them

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DIY intake-HV3-3" catless dp-180 tsat-DIY shift kit-murphy custom tune

Here is what I'm getting out of the above statement. You are not looking for a fast car because the wbody scene is "dying". However, if you end up changing your mind and stay in the wbody scene you will gen v top swap it. Hmmm.....indecisive modder syndrome. I would start with setting realistic goals, then planning your mods to achieve those goals. Don't worry I have my days where I'm like this too, other days I realize how foolish I am. For instance check out my "intercooler" or "cam" threads.

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I just don't mod cars to go fast. More monies in my pocket to do other things.

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Dubs:00 VW GTI VR6, Low and Slow 91 VW GTI 8v, Shave the Bay!! 91 VW Cabriolet 8v, bitch Basket
GP's:04 GP GT, Past now G-Ma's Girlfriend's 97 GP GT, "Project Pink Power"

Haha i know what you mean. It gets really bad some days. But in reality the farthest this car will go is headers/cam/HV3/tune. And dont try to persuade me any differently. LOL

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DIY intake-HV3-3" catless dp-180 tsat-DIY shift kit-murphy custom tune

I know what you mean.
I'm looking to eventually do a set of heads for my car.
Should be fun.
I want to see just what modified,all stock parts can do.
There's just something about the sound of an unboosted engine making power that I like.
It's a certain growl or roar that you just don't get from a boosted engine.
I seem to recall Crower putting out reground cams with about .460" lift.
Anyone ever hear of those or tried one?

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2005 GT owner [Non S/C] with a "big DIC".
Two years later and I still love the car.
Thanks Pontiac...Bleen is keen!

I'm kinda the opposite. I got sick of my N/A setup because the "growl" got old quick. I prefer my car to sound like there is a screaming baby under the hood when I hit the accelerator lmao.



Dang right. Gotta be able to afford my groceries so I can take my car to go get them:D

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